Episode 4: Disability Belongs in Literature

Cami Marble  00:00 

Welcome to the Disability Belongs Podcast. Just a quick disclaimer as we get started that the opinions expressed in the Disability Belongs Podcast do not necessarily reflect the opinions of CFILC, its member organizations, or YO! Disabled and Proud. And, with that out of the way, let's get on to the episode.  

 

Cami Marble  00:23 

Our guest today is a disability rights activist, communications consultant and author. Her wonderful book Demystifying Disability came out in 2021. And you should definitely check it out. I think the cover is adorable and it feels like a warm hug of disability activism. She co-hosts a podcast and her favorite animal is a peacock. Please welcome Emily Ladau. I'm so happy to have you here, Emily. 

 

Emily Ladau  00:50 

Hi! I'm so excited to be here. 

 

Cami Marble  00:53 

How are you doing today? 

 

Emily Ladau  00:55 

I'm great now that I'm talking to you. I've been looking forward to this all day. 

 

Cami Marble  00:59 

Awesome. I know I've been looking forward to it since our last interview with the YO! Disabled and Proud speaker series. That was a lot of fun! 

 

Emily Ladau  01:07 

That was so much fun. Honestly, one of my favorite speaking engagements that I've had the opportunity to do. So I'm pumped that we get to talk again today. 

 

Cami Marble  01:16 

Oh, that's so nice. Can you tell us what the inspiration was behind your writing of Demystifying Disability? 

 

Emily Ladau  01:24 

Yeah, absolutely. So I actually cannot take full credit for the inspiration, I have to hand it to my literary agent. She heard me on a podcast in 2019. And she reached out and she said, Hey, have you ever thought about writing a book, and I had been thinking about it, but it was sort of in the back of my mind. And then we began to work together on an idea for what a book could be. And initially, I was going to tell the story of what it's like to be the Disabled daughter of a Disabled mother. And then she said, this story is amazing and powerful. But before you jump into telling it, have you considered writing a book about disability itself.  

 

Emily Ladau  02:24 

And from there, the idea for Demystifying Disability really took shape. Because there's many, many books on the market, if you know where to look, that tell stories of disability, and that highlight the disability experience. But there wasn't really that one book that just offered some guidance and a framework and a little bit of a shared understanding of some of the basic concepts around disability. And, of course, I wasn't looking to write the Encyclopedia of Disability, there's no way to do that. But what I wanted to do was offer a starting point for people to learn and to begin to have conversations. So the inspiration really came from my passion for making disability more accessible to people and giving them that initial place to begin to learn and talk about it. 

 

Cami Marble  03:30 

I really love that. I know, as I was coming in to learn more about disability justice, that was something I kind of struggled with is that there were so many terms, and so much history. And it's just the information is available, but sometimes it's hard to find and like compile it on your own. And so I really love how your book kind of approaches the broader topic, but then gets into specifics, but it's an introduction, and it's really great. And now I'm going to recommend it to like everyone I know. So yeah, I've already told my mom I was like you have to read this book! 

 

Emily Ladau  04:06 

I'm so glad I really appreciate that. And honestly, my goal is to connect with one person at a time, I'm less worried about this urgency that I think a lot of activists feel to make these very broad sweeping changes. And I just want to have one on one conversations with people and help them to shift their thinking. And also, you know, you mentioned that it's hard to find a lot of the information. It's true if you don't know where to look, how do you begin? And once you begin, what if you find things that are not accessible or things that you have to pay a lot of money for or things that are not written in plain language. So my goal is to try to make disability, something that people feel comfortable talking about. 

 

Cami Marble  05:00 

Yeah, that was so helpful. I think, sometimes the other problem I run into is you'll find sources that are written not by Disabled people, but they're written, like from the perspective of a Disabled person, but it's not actually Disabled person writing it. And so then you get some kind of funky information. You're like, Wait, is this actually? Like? Is this actually what represents this? Like, what is representative of the community? Or did I find a bad source here? So yeah. 

 

Emily Ladau  05:31 

Oh, yeah. And it totally goes against the idea of “nothing about us without us” when you have these, quote, unquote, experts and talking heads who are publishing things on disability instead of actually centering Disabled people and our perspectives and our work. And so that was one of the major goals was, yes, I'm Disabled. But I also wanted to spotlight perspectives from other Disabled people, because I'm not the authority on disability. I'm one person. 

 

Cami Marble  06:04 

Yeah, it was so cool to read all the different quotes from people with a variety of different experiences and different disabilities. I really enjoyed reading that in the book. 

 

Emily Ladau  06:16 

Yeah, it was a lot of fun highlighting that. 

 

Cami Marble  06:20 

Can I also just say, thank you for including a, it was one sentence, and it almost made me cry. But in the section on accessibility, you had a sentence about not like asking people not to wear, like, scents to like public events. And as a person with severe scent allergies, that's a form of accessibility most people don't think about. And so to read it in your book made me so happy. 

 

Emily Ladau  06:49 

I'm so glad that you pointed that out. Because I know that there was no way to encompass every single disability experience in the book. And I know for sure that there are things that I left out, because I had less than 200 pages to work with. But it was such a priority to me to try to at least include as much as I possibly could fit in. And we tend to think of accessibility as Oh, there's a ramp. Yeah, sure. But that's not what access really means, or what access really looks like. And so I'm glad that that particular sentence resonated with you. Because if we're not being mindful of all of the different ways to make a space accessible, then we're not actually making it accessible. 

 

Cami Marble  07:39 

Yeah, and I think giving some of those examples that people might not always think of, is helpful so that people reimagine what accessibility is. And I think you did a really good job of that, in that chapter. So thank you.  

 

Cami Marble  07:53 

What was the process of writing that book as a Disabled author? 

 

Emily Ladau  08:00 

For me, it was very much a learning process as much as a teaching process. Because I don't consider myself any kind of expert, I recognize that I am a white, physically Disabled woman who communicates verbally. And because of that, I come to everything that I do through that lens. And that's not at all the only lens through which people experience disability. I always say if there's more than 1 billion Disabled people in the world, then that means there's going to be more than 1 billion opinions and experiences and ideas about disability. And so as a Disabled woman writing this book, I poured so much of myself into it. But I also had to ask myself, when do I need to pull back and recognize that there's more to what I'm talking about, than what I'm saying, and what I'm including? Who's missing from the conversation? And even now that the book is out in the world, there are still things I wish I had done differently and things that I wish that I had added. And I think that's just part of my ongoing learning process as both a Disabled person and as someone who wants to be the best possible ally and accomplice to other Disabled people. 

 

Cami Marble  09:32 

I think the book did a really good job. I'm just like singing the praises of your book. I really genuinely enjoyed and loved reading it. So this is just going to be like a little party for you on this podcast episode. 

 

Emily Ladau  09:44 

I mean, I'm having a blast. But no, you don't need to compliment me. We can just spend the whole time actually talking about you. We could totally just do that too. And I'd have a blast too. 

 

Cami Marble  09:53 

Aw, thanks! 

 

Cami Marble  09:54 

But I think you did a really good job of balancing that. It was a very great explanation of your experiences, but you also included other people, so that it's not just your voice. And I think that's something that's so important to recognize, and isn't always recognized in disability activism, because I think if there's representation, sometimes Disabled people get grouped together as just one entity. When again, everyone has different experiences. 

 

Emily Ladau  10:26 

Oh, yeah, I think a lot about the term disability community and how much we fall back on that term. But how it's not always very accurate, because although there's technically this umbrella term of disability, it's going to mean different things to different people. And different people are going to express themselves differently. And they're going to communicate and move about the world differently. And there is no singular experience of disability. So we can't really use the term disability community without acknowledging that, that holds so much. 

 

Cami Marble  11:08 

Yeah, I think that the term disability community does a really great job of showing the connection of Disabled people, but it doesn't necessarily show the individuality of each person with a disability. Which kind of leads us into our next question, which is, why is disability representation important, especially in literature and books like these? 

 

Emily Ladau  11:34 

I think there are two reasons. The first is of course, that stronger representation increases an accurate understanding of the disability experience. But in addition to that, more representation, also allows Disabled people to develop a stronger sense of self, and a stronger sense of identity and pride. Because when we don't get to see ourselves reflected back at us, or when what we do see reflected back at us is negative and stereotypical, that can be incredibly harmful and really easy to internalize. And so when we are able to see positive and accurate portrayals of disability, that, in turn, helps strengthen our sense of identity and culture, we can celebrate that we have a history. And even though I just was saying that disability community is a challenging term, there is something to be said for feeling like you are a part of the community. And so there's so much power in representation, both to shift our understandings of who we are, and to help other people shift their understandings of disability more broadly. 

 

Cami Marble  12:59 

I love that! One of the examples in your book was about I think it's Ulta Beauty when they had an ad with a wheelchair user in it, and I very distinctly remember the first Ulta store that I saw rollout that ad. Hey, rolled out, that was a funny pun! And I was like, Oh my gosh, it's a person in a wheelchair, and like their wheelchair is like my wheelchair! And I just think that's a good example of representation. Like a very, very basic example. And maybe it's kind of sad that I got so excited because I had never seen an ad with a wheelchair user, that like, seem accurate to my story as a wheelchair user. But it was also really cool to see that. 

 

Emily Ladau  13:47 

starting point, for sure. And it's also, I have to acknowledge an easy go to you, because it's a very visible and apparent representation of disability. And so when we think of disability representation, one of the first things we think of as a person in a wheelchair. And so, I feel like I need to acknowledge the fact that we are just at the beginning of disability representation, and really showcasing the diversity within the disability community. But at the same time, I want to celebrate that moment, and that win I'm seeing disability representation out in the wild, and just what it felt like, especially for me as a wheelchair user, who is constantly internalizing these messages that I do not meet society's standards for acceptable appearance, or I shouldn't really be associated with anything having to do with beauty. And all of a sudden, here's someone in a wheelchair, advertising a makeup store and I'm like, Heck yeah. Disabled people play with makeup too! 

 

Cami Marble  15:06 

Yeah, I think it's so important to hold the like both and have that moment that it's so exciting to see representation. But that doesn't mean that that's the end, and we had one store who had a wheelchair user in their ads and so now we have representation like we can check it off our list. Like that's definitely not what's going on. And there's so much growth that can come from there. 

 

Emily Ladau  15:31 

Yeah, I love the way you say it's both and that's how I try to hold things to, because I want to celebrate every bit of progress and I also want to keep pushing for better. 

 

Cami Marble  15:43 

Yeah. And I think sometimes that's hard to do. Because I feel like sometimes, I like go between this like super positive, like, oh, my gosh, disability justice is amazing. And there's all these great things happening. And then I'm like, but we've made like almost no progress. And I feel like everything the world is kind of still failing Disabled people. But like, I don't know how to handle both of those at the same time. 

 

Emily Ladau  16:05 

I think that it's okay to have those conflicting feelings, though. And part of that is actually disability culture in its own way, where we can hold space for the fact that we are both proud of who we are, and also burned out and exhausted. And I think that's really real. And we shouldn't avoid having conversations like that. Because the truth is that disability is not all sunshine and roses all the time. And I think if we acknowledge that, instead of ignoring that, and we have real open and honest conversations, then we're doing a service to everyone, by not trying to sprinkle toxic positivity on to the disability experience and just talking about it as the reality of part of the human experience. 

 

Cami Marble  17:03 

No, I agree with that. That reminds me, this is just a really silly tangent. But the other day, I decided I desperately needed to make. This, this is connected, I swear, like very tangentially. But I decided that I desperately needed to make lemonade. And so we went to like a local farmers market. And I was like, I need a giant bag of lemons, I need to make lemonade. And I got home. And I took a picture of like myself making lemonade and sent it to my friends. And I was like, when life gives you metaphorical lemons by literal lemons and make lemonade, because I don't like toxic positivity. 

 

Emily Ladau  17:41 

[laughter] Yeah, I mean, all of those quotes, I know some people hold really fast to them about life giving you lemons and things like that, but at the same time, I would be lying if I said that it was always easy to be Disabled. But that's very different than me asking for pity, or to be seen as a tragedy. It's more so that I'm trying to be real and vulnerable. 

 

Cami Marble  18:17 

Yeah, I agree.  

 

Emily Ladau  18:18 

I hope the lemonade was good! 

 

Cami Marble  18:20 

It was good. There's definitely still some in my fridge. So maybe I'll have some lemonade after this. [laughter] 

 

Cami Marble  18:25 

I think that can also be a hard thing is like, trying to not tell abled people how to treat Disabled people. But like, explain why that look you gave me in the grocery store when I was like, I just wheeled into the produce section and you looked at me like, aww, you got out of the house. I'm so proud of you. Like, that's not helpful. But also, yeah, like, it was hard to get out of the house. Like I just got out of the hospital. And it was really nice to like go to the store and use my wheelchair. But like, I don't need your abled pity but also recognize that things are harder than, harder for me, the way that society is currently set up. 

 

Emily Ladau  19:16 

It's so complex, right? Like I was thinking something very similar the other day, I was frustrated with my body because anytime I go somewhere is hard on my body. It's not comfortable to sit in my wheelchair for extended periods of time. And it's not comfortable for me to be out of my element and away from my home which is more accessible to me. So, I was out and I just kind of having a day of pain and I was also trying to enjoy myself and then I maneuvered my wheelchair and someone looked at me and said wow, that was some impressive maneuvering. And I just thought to myself, like, I'm uncomfortable. I'm not performing for you. I'm just living my life and I don't want your commentary on it. 

 

Cami Marble  20:16 

Yeah, I feel like it would be, like, interesting satire to like, make all of the comments that abled people make to disabled people to abled people like, wow, that was some impressive walking. Good job. Like you didn't bump into me. I'm so proud of you. 

 

Emily Ladau  20:36 

There's a video, a YouTube video of a comedian. I believe his name is Lawrence Clark. I could be getting that wrong. But he has cerebral palsy, I believe. And he just parked his wheelchair at the bottom of a set of stairs and starts telling everybody walking up the stairs, how inspiring they are. [laughter] 

 

Cami Marble  20:59 

Okay, that is really great. And I'll have to like check that out after this. You know, my friend Tatum who did the last interview with us, she's always trying to come up with a, like, equivalent term to a wheelchair bound, which I just really, really hate that phrase. And I think it's disgusting. Um, but she's like, like, I wouldn't be like, Wow, you're so walking bound? Like poor you, what? 

 

Emily Ladau  21:29 

Yeah, I don't think there is an accurate equivalent, I just think that it all comes down to how people perceive what mobility equipment actually means. And they don't really recognize that. For all intents and purposes, your legs are also mobility equipment, if you walk on them. 

 

Cami Marble  21:48 

Your shoes are mobility aids, they protect your feet from sharp objects. 

 

Emily Ladau  21:55 

Exactly. 

 

Cami Marble  21:57 

Okay, this is kind of a turn because we went down a whole road there. But what do you hope your readers will learn by reading your book? 

 

Emily Ladau  22:08 

Well, I actually think this is not a turn. And I in fact, think it's pretty relevant to this whole conversation, I want people to understand that there is complexity and nuance to the disability experience. And that it's okay to hold that. And it's okay to see disability as a complicated part of what it means to be a person. But to do so in a way that does not see me as inspiring or pitiful simply for existing, but rather, recognizes that disability is part of what makes me who I am. And that's okay to acknowledge. So, if someone took one thing away from my book, it's that disability is not a bad thing. Disability is very deeply human. 

 

Cami Marble  22:58 

Can you tell us what advice would you give to other Disabled people who are interested in writing and maybe writing a book? 

 

Emily Ladau  23:10 

I think the first thing that so many Disabled people need to push past is the idea that their story is not worth telling. Because we are told that over and over again, by society. And so it's an internal barrier, for sure. But it's one that I really strongly advise Disabled people to grapple with, and to come to an understanding that your story is actually important and valuable. And also understand that you don't need to place these expectations on yourself to write some number one New York Times bestseller. Like that's not what I'm about at all. My priority is telling people that if you write on a blog, if you use Twitter, if you send a text to someone, all of those can count as telling your story.  

 

Emily Ladau  24:16 

It's not some kind of rule to what it means to be a writer. There's definitely in the professional world and the academic world, a lot of barriers to entry to being a writer. And that's just because it's completely inaccessible and full of biases. And that's a reality that a lot of people face. And so navigating your way through that and publishing something is a privilege, but you don't have to publish something in a traditional sense to be a writer or storyteller. Start where you are, and recognize that whatever platform you're using, and whatever story you're communicating is important. 

 

Cami Marble  24:56 

I love that. And I think that's goes back to something you said earlier about disability justice can be just impacting one person, like, it doesn't have to be this broad sweeping thing it can be, it's okay if it's a broad sweeping thing, and there are some activists that that is the way they like to work. And that's really cool. But for me, it's more important that like, I make connections with individual humans, and if there's one person that listens to this podcast episode, and resonates with it, like, that's really cool for me. 

 

Emily Ladau  25:34 

That's exactly how I feel about things whenever one person reaches out or sends an email or, you know, DMs me and says, Hey, this made a difference for me, because I felt less alone, or I didn't understand this before. But now I do, or I want to take action on this issue that you're talking about. I love that. That's amazing to me. And in fact, I think that aligns more with disability justice, because I think that there's a lot of expectation that we place on ourselves as a society that we always need to be producing and working. And we always need to be results oriented. But in fact, sometimes the work of disability justice is not rigid, like that.  

 

Cami Marble  26:27 

Yeah, there aren't these like, it's not like there's like a series of benchmarks. Like, if you reach 100, which this is, like, in the social media world, this is a very real thing, which makes activism hard, because so much of it is now social media oriented. And like, if you reach 100 followers, that's like, okay, but if you reach 1000 followers, like that makes you better at life. But like, obviously, that is not true. I say, wouldn't my little baby podcast but I just think that's interesting, and kind of a contrast to how maybe, like, quote, unquote, the rest of the world functions as, as compared to Disabled people is that it's like, kind of a different, not lifestyle. I don't know what the word I'm looking for is, I don't know if that made any sense.  

 

Emily Ladau  27:20 

No, I totally get you. And honestly, I am of two minds about social media. On the one hand, I find that I'm constantly having to fight against people who think that it's what I've heard called slacktivism, where you just send a tweet and call it a day. And, you know, I like to remind people that social media has made activism accessible for a lot of people. And if social media is how you are an advocate, or an activist, that that's not slacking. You know, of course, it's important to put meaningful action and intention behind what you post. But if it's your primary means of getting the word out, that's okay. And that's not you being a slacker. At the same time. I also think that there's this pressure to perform on social media. And people are so focused on follower numbers. And I think this is somebody who has a fair number of followers, but it's not like I sent some like, viral tweet, and then overnight, got a bunch of followers. I've been on social media for years. Like I've had my Twitter for almost a decade. And for me, it wasn't about growing a follower count, it was, I'd rather have 100 people who are engaged with what I'm saying, then 150,000 people who hit the Follow button, and then never pay attention to what I say again. So I really am all about making a smaller difference within a smaller community, instead of pushing yourself to try to be this like, social media influencer. 

 

Cami Marble  29:09 

This is probably a, like, this is a term that my brain just came up with. And it probably groups people together too much. But I feel like, for me, it's like introvert activism. Like if like I only have one, I only have so much energy as a chronically ill and Disabled person who is in school full time to do things, like quote, unquote, on the side. But also, I'm very much an introvert. And so like, social interaction is wonderful. But I can only take so much of it. And so like, sometimes, posting one thing is the energy that I have. And again, that's definitely not slacking. That's just like paying attention to my body and what it needs. 

 

Emily Ladau  29:54 

Oh, yeah, that's the reality of living in a Disabled body and knowing what you need to do and I overextend yourself. And I don't take my own advice. But I do advise people all the time, that you don't owe people your story. And you don't need to constantly be out there on social media. And I mean, I know, I just recently took a few days where I tried to unplug a little bit. And it felt really great. But it was a reminder that it's so easy to burn out when you're talking about this stuff all the time, and that you do have to take care of yourself, and that you don't owe it to people to constantly be online. 

 

Cami Marble  30:40 

Yeah, I think that's something that's hard about being specifically like a Disabled, again, for lack of a better term, influencer, because that's what everyone is using, is that you can't separate yourself from that. Because disability is part of who you are. And so you can't be like, here's my social media self, and here's my like, regular self, whereas some, like abled influencers might be able to do that a little bit more if they're presenting a different like a social media version of themselves, where you can kind of disconnect a little bit more like you can't fully disconnect yourself from disability justice, if that's an integrated part of who you are, which for most Disabled people it is. 

 

Emily Ladau  31:25 

Yeah, I always say that disability is so inextricably linked to who I am. It's like, I joke that I am a professional Disabled person. I'm just like disabled 24/7. Because first of all, I am like, I am always Disabled, there is no taking it off and putting it on the shelf. But also, just because it's always on my mind. I'm always thinking about it. And, you know, sometimes I want to take a break from that sometimes I want to just, like, be a person in the world and not worry about everything related to disability, but at the same time, it's part of who I am. So it shapes everything that I do and everything that I think and every place that I go. 

 

Cami Marble  32:04 

And in another thing it shapes, you also have a podcast! Like that transition? 

 

Emily Ladau  32:11 

I love it. I love it. Very clever. 

 

Cami Marble  32:13 

Um, can you tell us about your podcast, The Accessible Stall? 

 

Emily Ladau  32:18 

Yeah, so I co host the Accessible Stall with my friend, Kyle. And we started it five, almost six years ago now, because we realized that we were constantly having conversations about disability. And we knew for a fact that other people were having these conversations, too. So why not engage people in those conversations, especially in a space where at the time, there were only a few other disability podcasts, it was a big gap in the space. And so we were like, Let's start filling that gap. And since then, and believe me, I'm not saying we're trendsetters, like people come up with ideas on their own. But I am saying there's a ton more disability podcasts out there now. And that makes me so happy. Because it finally means that people are taking advantage of the podcasting platform as a way to have these conversations. And so I just want more disability in the podcasting space. I love it so much. I need to see more people who are like, Yeah, we want to have these currencies, and we want to engage in that. And it's been really nice to see that momentum. 

 

Cami Marble  33:45 

I always joke with my friends that we're just going to start recording all of our conversations, because we're always having, albeit very odd conversations on disability, but there are always conversations on disability happening. Like we should just record all the conversations and edit them into podcast episodes. 

 

Emily Ladau  34:05 

I feel like sometimes the conversations that I have, in private moments, I'm like, I want to hit the record button because I need everybody to hear this because then maybe they'll understand the nuance that I'm trying to get across. So I totally understand that. 

 

Cami Marble  34:19 

Do you have any advice for me as a fairly new disability podcaster? 

 

Emily Ladau  34:28 

Oh, good question. I know how cliche this is going to sound but 100% stay true to yourself as you're podcasting because the longer you podcasts and more people will reach out to you with their own thoughts and opinions. And I really value feedback from people. And I love when people send messages to us. that made me think and make me rethink sometimes how we frame things. And this goes back to what I was saying earlier about how I am always still learning. And so I don't consider myself the expert or authority. But also, if you believe something, if you share something, if it's your personal experience, it's okay to own that and embrace that and be who you are. 

 

Cami Marble  35:29 

Thank you. I guess I'll continue to include my really random Cami tangents in every episode. 

 

Emily Ladau  35:37 

Do it! Be yourself. I feel like that's the fun part of podcasting is that you don't have to be so rigid, your personality can come through. 

 

Cami Marble  35:50 

Yeah, I really love that. As I am recording these episodes, I'm including little silly tidbits and things. 

 

Emily Ladau  35:57 

Yeah. I feel like Disabled people don't always just get to enjoy being ourselves. We always have to be on. And we always have to be, like I was saying before, performing for other people. But in a space like a podcast, you have a chance to just let yourself come through. 

 

Cami Marble  36:18 

On one of your recent, I think it was on the podcast, your podcast, Instagram, you were talking about how Disabled people are full people, which should not be as wild of a concept as it is. But fun fact, Disabled people are full people. And not personhood includes disability, and sometimes interests that are a little bit more separate from disability. In the spirit of that, what are some things you'd like to do for fun? 

 

Emily Ladau  36:48 

I love this question. And yeah, that was a little clip, I think you're talking about from an episode that we did recently, on the fact that you are expected to eat, sleep and breathe disability all the time as a disabled person. And we forget that there's other things in the world that you can be interested in, because you are a whole and complex human being. And so for me, I absolutely love theater, I love going to see all kinds of random shows. I really love cultural things like museums, I love getting to travel, safely though, of course, as the pandemic continues, I love just getting to be outside in the fresh air. And I like doing crafty things. And sometimes I just like to binge Netflix shows. You know, just being a person. 

 

Cami Marble  37:48 

I love that you say crafty things. Because every time someone asked me what my hobbies are, like, I don't know, crafty things.  

 

Emily Ladau  37:58 

Well, I mean, in my ideal world, like if I had more time, I would like make all the craft projects, but because I don't. I just like to say, Yeah, every once in a while, I like to get my hands messy. 

 

Cami Marble  38:14 

Now, right now, from where I'm sitting, I can see my last like craft project endeavor, which is making polymer clay earrings. There's like 

 

Emily Ladau  38:24 

Oh, those are so trendy right now.  

 

Cami Marble  38:26 

Yeah, they're pretty fun to make. I am having a hard time with getting the backs of the earrings to stay on. Because I'm allergic to scented things. And most of the like glues that people use have a very strong scent. So this is my like, aside from disability project, but still very much includes my disability because I can't find glue to use. But that's my next goal is to find a way to make it slightly more accessible to myself. 

 

Emily Ladau  39:01 

That's really real. So you can do something cool. And you can also do it in a way that works for you. 

 

Cami Marble  39:06 

Yeah, so. So as we're getting towards the end of our time together, which I'm sad that went by so fast. So the name of the podcast is Disability Belongs, what does disability belongs mean to you? 

 

Emily Ladau  39:24 

I love this question. And also just love the name of the podcast in general and to me it means that disability belongs in every conversation. Disabled people belong in every space at every metaphorical table. That is not some niche thing that we should push to the side, but rather a part of the fabric of the diversity of our humanity. And maybe it's cliche, but I think that's a really beautiful thing. 

 

Cami Marble  40:02 

That is so beautiful. Thank you. It has been absolutely a joy to have you on the podcast today. As we wrap up, is there somewhere on social media that we can follow you? And I will also link this in the show notes when we publish the episode. 

 

Emily Ladau  40:17 

Wow, for sure. And I have absolutely loved this conversation. One of the most refreshing podcast conversations I've had in a while honestly. As for where you can find me on social media, I am on Twitter @Emily_Ladau, or on Instagram at @EmilyLadau. 

 

Cami Marble  40:43 

Awesome. And over on Instagram we also have a podcast channel @Disability_Belongs_Podcast. And we will link all of these accounts as well as Emily's podcast in the show notes. Thank you so much Emily, it was so wonderful talking to you!   

 

Emily Ladau  41:01 

Thank you! 

 

Cami Marble  41:04 

Thank you so much for choosing to listen to the Disability Belongs Podcast. This podcast would not be possible without the support of the California Foundation for Independent Living Centers in the YO! Disabled and Proud program. Thank you to my entire team at YO! We can't wait for our next episode and we hope you'll join us then.